"Renewable" energy...so loved by Obama

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cruiser Posted - 1/2/2014 11:27:02 AM | show profile | flag this post

and the left...continues to be a sham.

The taxpayers of thirty states pay more to subsidize wind producers (through the federal government's producer tax credit) than the state derives from wind production.

Texas is the biggest "taker" of subsidies, taking some $642 million while paying only $248 into the program.

http://www.ncpa.org/sub/dpd/index.php?Article_ID=23948&utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=DPD

The article estimates that 50-75 percent of wind energy wholesale price is borne by taxpayers. So when etwinkie and others try to tell you wind energy pays for itself, they are...ahh, not being truthful.

etaoin shrdlu Posted - 1/2/2014 2:59:56 PM | show profile | flag this post

Thanks for another belly laugh, cruzo!

Here are more of those nasty old left-leaning facts that just keep getting in the way of your Ayn Rand fantasy world:

"The cost of electricity from onshore wind turbines will drop 12% in the next five years thanks to a mix of lower-cost equipment and gains in output efficiency, according to new research from Bloomberg New Energy Finance.

"The best wind farms in the world already produce power as economically as coal, gas and nuclear generators; the average wind farm will be fully competitive by 2016. [Bloomberg New Energy Finance]"

https://www.bnef.com/PressReleases/view/172

etaoin shrdlu Posted - 1/2/2014 3:00:56 PM | show profile | flag this post

I notice you've given up on...

criticizing solar power -- since you argued there was no way to store the energy overnight!

Hope Santa brought you batteries for Christmas!

cruiser Posted - 1/2/2014 3:59:41 PM | show profile | flag this post

The FACT is

right now wind power is NOT self-sustaining economically. Not even close. And any thoughts of the future are speculative, at best. It MIGHT become economically feasible but it's not at present.

And...

"since you argued there was no way to store the energy overnight"

You're a bald-faced liar. I never said that...or anything like that. I'm very much aware of how solar works but it...like wind power...is NOT self-sustaining economically on a large scale. It may HELP homeowners and building superintendents in most areas REDUCE their energy bills but the payback period is measured in DECADES. And the environmental impact for large-scale installations is horrendous.

In fact, unlike you, I'm very much aware of how ALL electric generating methods work...and their economics.

Grateful Deadline Posted - 1/2/2014 7:42:38 PM | show profile | flag this post

*** The FACT is

right now wind power is NOT self-sustaining economically. ***

And you called another poster "a bald-faced liar"?

Pfffft!

Of course, it's fruitless to suggest that you do more research, since you can't. If you knew how, though, what you'd learn might surprise the silliness right out of you.

mpdodgson Posted - 1/2/2014 10:20:11 PM | show profile | flag this post

The real sham cruise

is your whole thread.

"Renewable" energy...so loved by Obama...and the left...continues to be a sham." Really?? Now you know even more than all the oil and gas companies do??

Every major energy producing company in the world is investing in renewable energy. From ExxonMobil to BP to Chevron, these guys are actively doing what you think is stupid. They even promote their efforts every day in commercials. Maybe your basement TV doesn't get PBS or NBC etc. Fossil fuels are going to run out--DUH--"We're fresh out of dinosaurs" as the old oil company commercial put it.

"WASHINGTON, DC, December 17, 2012 (ENS) – A majority of the world’s largest companies are not waiting for governments to mandate renewable energy and lower greenhouse gas emissions, they are taking it upon themselves to act first. A new report from investment and conservation organizations shows that more than half of the Fortune 100 and more than two-thirds of the Global 100 have set carbon emissions reduction commitments, renewable energy commitments or both.

http://ens-newswire.com/2012/12/17/worlds-largest-companies-embracing-clean-energy/

Thought you loved the free market? And btw?? "since you argued there was no way to store the energy overnight" You're a bald-faced liar. I never said that...or anything like that"

Yea. You did. You were trying to argue that solar power is stupid because the sun is only out half the day, and we all jumped on you for it (batteries??). You also argued that wind power would never work because it takes up too much land and kills birds.

Only 'Obama and the left' love renewable energy sources?? Not 'energy companies, WallStreet, investors, entrepreneurs', etc etc?? That's your 'factual based stand'?? You stickin with that?? Or are we going to see another slippery slide out of what you now realize was a dumb thing to say?

cruiser Posted - 1/2/2014 11:42:35 PM | show profile | flag this post

That would be VERY weak

even for a group of elementary school students. But I realize that when you've been thoroughly spanked you have to try SOMEthing.

etaoin shrdlu Posted - 1/3/2014 8:54:25 AM | show profile | flag this post

Weakest thread of the month...

looks like cruzo needed to puff himself up -- and got slapped down hard.

He fails to substantiate how he says technology will not improve, or the tipping point that comes with a significant economy of scale, and ignores the fact that every energy company is investing in wind and other renewable sources.

But he can hurl the hyperbole.

Care to address the points we've laid out that buried your assumption in the initial post, cruzo?

Didn't think so.

cruiser Posted - 1/3/2014 11:25:19 AM | show profile | flag this post

The only "points" you laid out, pal

were talking points derived from the Center for American Progress (CAP), a left wing policy and "research" organization started by John Podesta, a long-time friend of the Clintons and the head of Obama's transition team. It's sole purpose is to push the left wing agenda.

As part of that agenda it conducted an 8:45 AM conference call with left wing reporters, talking heads, politicians, congress members, etc., during which the daily talking points were laid out and discussed. While I have not heard anything about CAP for several weeks the fact that many, many times talking heads and other Democrats will repeat precisely the same talking points...often in the exact same words...leads me to believe the effort is ongoing.

Much of the commentary posted here by left wingers is derived from those same talking points.

etaoin shrdlu Posted - 1/3/2014 12:00:49 PM | show profile | flag this post

Really, cruzo?

Care to back that up with an actual link to a CAP talking point?

Your "reading comprehension" is really pathetic as all of our "casual readers" will notice that I have linked to independent sources -- not a partisan think tank -- when sourcing my points.

You, on the other hand, have provided no sources for your weak claims.

And you can't seem to muster a single argument against my statements.

If they were indeed "talking points," you'd have no problem with a counter-argument.

But all you have, cruzo, is more hyperbole.

cruiser Posted - 1/3/2014 12:15:57 PM | show profile | flag this post

Unless you add something material to the discussion

please forgive my silence. I'm not going to waste my time responding to your juvenile "Did not," "Did too," arguments. While you're passably proficient at rhetoric you're woefully short on facts.

Grateful Deadline Posted - 1/3/2014 1:15:45 PM | show profile | flag this post

Aw, cruiser, can't you call ES "pal" just once before you leave?

It's the grown-up thing to do.

etaoin shrdlu Posted - 1/3/2014 1:50:32 PM | show profile | flag this post

I think he's called me "hoss"...

in the past. But never "pall," Grateful.

And he wants me to add something to the conversation! He hasn't even read the sources I've posted. Poor fellow, his "reading comprehension" is so bad.

Oh, and what Cruzo failed to mention is that those tax credits he complained about in the initial post have expired.

And guess what. Those big energy companies that were building wind fars, are STILL building them!

cruiser Posted - 1/3/2014 4:55:57 PM | show profile | flag this post

This is material so I'll respond

etwinkie is betting that nobody will try to corroborate his left wing echo box sites and discover they're far from accurate.

Grateful Deadline Posted - 1/3/2014 6:44:26 PM | show profile | flag this post

Gawd. What in the world did they mix with your Geritol this morning, cruiser?

cruiser Posted - 1/4/2014 2:02:59 PM | show profile | flag this post

etwinkie is also betting

that his left wing brethren on here won't take the time to check the links he offers because most of them DO NOT support the argument he's trying to make. His comments are largely full of exaggeration, distortion and outright untruth.

orthicon Posted - 1/4/2014 8:34:38 PM | show profile | flag this post

one problem with your posit, cruiztwit..

if it's such a sham, howcum your paymasters the Koch brothers are spending hundreds of millions of dollars to try to block it everywhere?..

solar, wind.. whatever..they're fighting it every step of the way.

why would that be, do you suppose?

cruiser Posted - 1/4/2014 8:38:34 PM | show profile | flag this post

Let me let you in on something profound

IF your brain is conditioned to accept it:

The Koch brothers are billionaires. If "renewable" energy was so viable, the Koch brothers would be INVESTING in it...not arguing against it. They're not stupid.

If you're reporting that they are trying to downplay it, that oughta tell you something.

Grateful Deadline Posted - 1/4/2014 9:08:54 PM | show profile | flag this post

They're not stupid. You're not stupid. Everybody else is stupid.

Now, *that's* stupid.

Grateful Deadline Posted - 1/4/2014 9:12:33 PM | show profile | flag this post

Ah -- got it. It's the "I don't have to explain it to you, you're too stupid" cruiser-bot algorithm.

Now I have triggered the next step: "I'm through with you and your kind, pal and or dearie."

And that is egregiously ...

Grateful Deadline Posted - 1/4/2014 9:13:40 PM | show profile | flag this post

... indubitable!

con Posted - 1/5/2014 3:33:49 PM | show profile | flag this post

dear leader loves renewable energy much like a drug dealer loves money laundering.

these "green energy" companies get fed tax coin-they then turn around and make huge donations to obama and the democrats.

etaoin shrdlu Posted - 1/6/2014 8:55:37 AM | show profile | flag this post

Cruzo's losing his bet...

that our "casual readers" here won't do a little research -- maybe read my links to independent sources.

And he's hoping no one out there uses just the least bit of logic.

Wind farms aren't being built by Greenpeace and CAP -- they're being built by energy companies and utilities.

Even Conservative states like Wyoming have utilities jumping on the bandwagon after the wind power market in Colorado has also brought more than $4 billion in capital investment and 4,000 jobs to the state,

That's "CAPITAL INVESTMENT" -- you know, from rich conservative Wall Street types looking to turn a profit.

I think we once pointed out here that cruzo's knowledge of renewable energy capablities were based on an article in the popular press he red back in the 1970s -- and fails to take into account technological advances since then.

I imagine he's connecting to this board through an IBM mainframe the size of a two bedroom house because computers will never get any smaller or any more efficient than they were in 1972.


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