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The NRA's Police State
Posted - 12/23/2012 7:46:43 PM | show profile | flag this post
You people are incorrigibly stupid. The saddest thing is that you seem to be content in your stupidity.
Posted - 12/23/2012 8:15:32 PM | show profile | flag this post
We didn't fall for an internet hoax dated some fifteen years ago, and we're the stupid ones.
BTW, about this all being some Grand Plan to take away your guns?? The "Brady" people you're so afraid of still say
"As the largest national, non-partisan, grassroots organization leading the fight to prevent gun violence, The Brady Campaign, the Million Mom March and the Brady Center believe that a safer America can be achieved without banning all guns."
Well, they must be stupid too.
Posted - 12/23/2012 8:51:56 PM | show profile | flag this post
in the dream world of your own design. I have never before seen such an intense urge to deny reality.
|it's just tv folks||
Posted - 12/23/2012 9:47:48 PM | show profile | flag this post
look in the mirror
2oldcruzytwit, just look in the mirror.
Posted - 12/26/2012 8:55:30 AM | show profile | flag this post
if the nra really wanted a po-po state, liberals would be all for it.
Posted - 12/28/2012 11:44:55 AM | show profile | flag this post
Revisiting post, mp
I wanted to wait till after Xmas to address part of your post.
You said, "I also thought it was interesting how you melded some of the 2nd with the 'Preamble' (that's where the "provide for the common defense" part is) I've had this debate before...linking 'common defense' to the 2nd is okay, but that other part of the Preamble ("promote the general welfare") doesn't mean 'ObamaCare' is called for."
To me, the reason that "promote the general welfare" does not apply to Obamacare, is that Obamacare does not promote the GENERAL welfare. Instead, it promotes the welfare of one group of people at the expense of another. This is not a case where everyone is taxed and the money goes to an agency, like the military, which protects all of us equally. It's a case where the government steals money from the sector of people whom they think can afford it, to give to others.
If you were to take the "promote the general welfare" clause to the extreme, you could justify nationalizing the airlines, the banks, the housing industry and universal healthcare, among other atrocities. At the very extreme you might try to justify communism.
I feel that promoting the "general" welfare is correctly applied to functions like FDA over site, consumer protection and building infrastructure. All of which don't take a huge toll on our freedoms.
Posted - 12/28/2012 3:09:21 PM | show profile | flag this post
You make a good point--sort of--but I think it falls apart because you're so "selective" in what "You" consider...
"("promote the general welfare") doesn't mean 'ObamaCare' is called for."). Well, you're entitled to your opinion, but keep in mind this wasn't a case of 'Dictator Obama' by any means. The HCR package was voted for an elected Congress, signed by an elected president; and upheld by the Supreme Court. Think we've got everything covered there.
"I feel that promoting the "general" welfare is correctly applied to functions like FDA over site, consumer protection and building infrastructure" BUT Obamacare "promotes the welfare of one group of people at the expense of another."
Wait a darn minute. The FDA spends millions on drugs I'll never take. The governent inspects, regulates, spending millions on proucts I'll never buy. They regulate cars, airplanes, and ships I'll never be on. Not to mention national parks I'll never visit. Won't even bring up school taxes, since i don't have any kids at home.And they build dams and levees 7 states away from me. What's up with that??
See what I mean? You get to pick and choose what you think the government should be responsible for....and since YOU have insurance and/or aren't sick...you don't think that's part of The General Welfare.
Posted - 12/29/2012 3:02:19 PM | show profile | flag this post
I hate to add reality to your flight of fancy but
"promote the general welfare" DOES NOT mean spend every citizen blind promoting a "general welfare" that is really not necessary because we have (had) a health care system that worked for everyone...even those who could not afford insurance...at a cheaper rate than Obamacare.
Posted - 12/29/2012 3:35:21 PM | show profile | flag this post
I never said
"Promote the General Welfare" means "spend every citizen blind"
I was pointing out that every taxpayer helps pay for the things that are good for the country as a whole--EVEN IF I personally never ever utilize them. That goes for everything from a federal highway in Alaska to Bush spending a few trillion on wars i was totally against. THAT STUFF I'm sure you maintain 'Tough. Suck it up'. But health care for my neighbor who doesn't have it??? I ain't payin for that...
(and of course we are anyway) 'We have a health care system that works'??? Maybe in your basement dwelling world, but out here in reality , the public is very happy with the ObamaCare reforms that have already kicked in, and making people get their own insurance is helluva lot cheaper than ER bills we all end up paying for.
Posted - 12/29/2012 4:41:27 PM | show profile | flag this post
"insurance (read: obamacare) is helluva lot cheaper than
ER bills we all end up paying for"
No, pal, it emphatically is NOT. This year alone family plan costs jumped by around $1,100 bringing the cost increases to around $3,000 since Obama took office in 2009. And wait until after the first of the year when health care costs jump again by an average of $2,500.
What Obama has done is screw millions to pander to thousands. We'd be MUCH better off if he'd left things the way they were...the indigent getting their care from emergency rooms while premiums for the rest of stayed relatively constant...moving with inflation.
Posted - 12/29/2012 5:12:39 PM | show profile | flag this post
*** What Obama has done is screw millions to pander to thousands. We'd be MUCH better off if he'd left things the way they were...the indigent getting their care from emergency rooms while premiums for the rest of stayed relatively constant...moving with inflation. ***
How do you come up with this fiction???
"Moving with inflation." Baloney. OMG, what BIG baloney! You have no idea what you're talking about, do you? OMG, I can't believe you even wrote that little pile of crap! Who did you expect to fool?
I'm sorry -- I am simply astounded at every assertion in your post. You haven't gotten out much in the past 12 years, have you? Geez, Louise!
Posted - 12/29/2012 5:24:52 PM | show profile | flag this post
Such a tool.
Health insurance has been going up for years: "The total cost of family health insurance, for both employers and employees, hit $15,000 last year, up 62 percent since 2003" "Worker's Spending On Health Premiums Surges 74% in 8 Years" and on and on:
Here's your problem; ObamaCare wasn't even signed into law until March 2010. But it MUST be responsible for a decade of price hikes before then, right??
Besides that--the taxes/penalties don't even kick in until 2014. But but but Obamacare MUST be responsible for my premium hike last year right?? Or five years ago?? You're such a Tool. In short--not one penny of anyones increase has anything to do with ObamaCare--it has everything to do with the insurance company gouging you.
Where were you during the last campaign??? All those stories about Company Execs saying they have to lay off people/cut hours/increase prices...because...what they "MAY HAVE TO PAY" once ObamaCare fully takes effect--NEXT YEAR. Such a tool.
If anything--there's one provision that has kicked in--"including a rate review provision where insurance companies will have to justify rate hikes above 10% to your State and post details online immediately" But some states have refused to allow that. Thanks. The new laws also "makes it illegal to charge women different rates than men"
Another bottom line--if you already have insurance (the vast majority) you're obviously not going to face a few bucks in penalty because you don't have insurance (duh).
Lastly, your "What Obama has done is screw millions to pander to thousands". REALLY?? "48.6 million Americans went without insurance during all of 2011...49.9 million in 2010." That to you is "thousands"????
Why don't you actually quote actual facts instead of being such a wingnut tool?
Posted - 12/29/2012 6:06:40 PM | show profile | flag this post
"it MUST be responsible for a decade of price hikes"
Here's where you lose any credibility you might have otherwise had.
I specified a time frame for my post...and it was from the start of Obama's presidency...2009...to the coming year. I said NOTHING about a decade of price hikes.
But...of course...you can't contradict what I said (it was one hundred percent accurate) so you feel the need to try to obfuscate the facts with a specious reference to a decade.
Sorry, pal...I know you're desperate but there's NO WAY you can make yourself "right" on this issue.
Posted - 12/29/2012 6:09:52 PM | show profile | flag this post
citing obamacare facts as justification is like citing the Communist Manifesto to "prove" the Soviet Union was a pretty nice place. We all know better.
Posted - 12/29/2012 7:39:24 PM | show profile | flag this post
You show me any source that shows how--"This year alone family plan costs jumped by around $1,100 bringing the cost increases to around $3,000--BECAUSE of any penalties and/or addtional taxes because of ObamaCare. You can't. You simply can't.
YES insurance rates have gone up "since Obama took office in 2009"--no one disputes that...they have been going up steadily for a decade. We all know that. That's the insurance companies increasnig their rates because the cost of health care has gone up. You know--Capitalism and Free Market, and all that stuff you hold so dear. Gas Prices and gold have gone up too. Obama's fault??
It has nothing to do with ObamaCare because it wasn't signed into law until March of 2010, and the expenses don't kick in until next year. So you're making things up--solely becuase you hate Obama. That's it. Always your bottom line. Just admit it. You didn't read an of the FACTS because they don't fit into your paranoid hate filled agenda.
Posted - 12/30/2012 12:52:00 AM | show profile | flag this post
"It has nothing to do with ObamaCare"
It has EVERYTHING to do with Obamacare. The bean counters from those insurance companies are not dummies. They've read the law...they know what's coming...and they're preparing their companies to function in the Obamacare world. That means covering their costs and ensuring a reasonable profit.
Your denial is just not intelligent.
Posted - 12/30/2012 10:48:31 AM | show profile | flag this post
That was so lame cruise.
You pointed out that insurance costs have risen since Obama took office. Agreed. We know that. It's been going up for years (up 62 percent since 2003" "Surges 74% in 8 Years" and on and on).
But ObamaCare has been law for less than two years--and none of the penalties/taxes have taken effect yet. So, logically, since the insurance companies have been raising rates for a decade, and that has nothing to do with Obamacare, it must be just that insurance companies have been raising their rates. Logically.
But but but... you try to get around that by now saying it was the insurance comanies thinking ahead ("they know what's coming... That means covering their costs and ensuring a reasonable profit.") Be serious. They knew that in 2003?!?! Most people didn't even know who Obama was in 2003, but they knew?!?!?
So of course you're wrong there. Then you compound it by claiming 48-49 un-insured Americans is really just "thousands". Wrong again.
You also claim "We'd be MUCH better off if he'd left things the way they were...the indigent getting their care from emergency rooms" Wow--that one is just way wrong. The ER is helluva lot more expensive than preventative care.
You also claimed "premiums for the rest of stayed relatively constant...moving with inflation." Another whopper. How is 60-74% increase in nine years keeping with inflation??? Where the hell do you live??
You're just wrong wrong wrong on every single point. But you don't care. You hate Obama. And that's more important than those lousy facts.
Posted - 12/30/2012 11:05:52 AM | show profile | flag this post
Having an honest discussion with you is impossible
because you are anything but honest.
Posted - 12/30/2012 11:56:13 AM | show profile | flag this post
Could you please lay off the insults?
You purport to be a grown man, so start acting like one.
Posted - 12/30/2012 1:25:59 PM | show profile | flag this post
What makes you think you...
a mean-spirited old witch...has any right to dictate to the rest of us?
Posted - 12/30/2012 2:25:26 PM | show profile | flag this post
In fact, Americans will get a MASSIVE
Obamacare tax hike totaling $1 TRILLION beginning January first.
In particular, pay attention to five NEW taxes that are set to cut deeply into the take-home pay of working Americans:
1. Medical device tax that will make everything from pacemakers to artificial hips more expensive.
2. A $2500 cap on flexible spending accounts that many Americans use for medical care...especially for special-needs children, etc.
3. Massive increases on the tax rates of investment income from capital gains, dividends and other investments.
4. An increase of 2.5 percent on the deduction threshold for medical expenses, which will impact the sickest Americans.
5. An increase on the medical payroll tax for self-employed Americans.
If ANYONE still believes the costs of medical care will go down under Obamacare, I have a bridge for sale.
Posted - 12/30/2012 3:34:20 PM | show profile | flag this post
Man, you are back-tracking so fast
It's leaving skid marks and whiplash.
So you're not defending that bullshit that there's only "thousands" are un-insured when in fact it's like 48 million people, you're not defending that bullshit that the ER is cheaper than having a family doctor, you're not defending that bullshit that insurance companies started raising their rates a decade ago because they magically saw ObamaCare coming, you're not defending that bullshit that premiums have kept up with inflation; you're not defending that bullshit that ObamaCare is the CAUSE for all ourrate to be higher--even though none of the "money part" has kicked in yet...
Now you're moving on. Back into your "future/what if" mode. "In fact, Americans will get a MASSIVE Obamacare tax hike.." Gee. Thought you said that already happened...
YES. There will be new taxes. Some. My school tax goes up too, what's your point. Medical devices. If you don't use them, then your taxes won't go up. Same thing with a flex account. And it's stil cheaper than paying for 48 million people. and the whole argument is based on:
"one option in play if lawmakers can ever agree"
"If the value of job-based health insurance were taxed "
" it would raise nearly $150 billion in 2013, according to congressional estimates"
""If you are looking to raise revenue to pay for tax reform"
"It's hard to see how lawmakers can avoid touching health insurance if they..."
"Next spring will be three years since Congress passed the health care overhaul but, because of a long phase-in, many of the taxes to finance the plan are only now coming into effect."
So...It's "IF", "MAYBE", We don't know....Jeez. I thought you said this was all fact nad had already happened....?
You're reaching so far out of bounds it's into psycho territory. You make up stuff that didn't happen, or you project stuff that we have no idea about. But but but...Screw the country as a whole--I hate Obama. THAT is your message and it's quite clear.
Posted - 12/30/2012 7:35:20 PM | show profile | flag this post
This is a waste of my time
Either you're incorrigibly stupid...or incorrigibly dishonest. I know which I suspect.
Posted - 12/30/2012 8:14:04 PM | show profile | flag this post
Such a waste of time
That before you skedaddle out of here with your bruised ego between your legs you had to tell us it was a waste of time. it's your MO.
You got caught again in a huge lie (years and years of high insurance rates are all Obama's fault), and then tripped by a couple of medium sized lies (only 'thousands' of un-insured, ER visits are cheaper than Dr visits, premiums have kept up w/inflation, etc). And even your traditonal fallback of 'Well...it could happen...' didn't work. And oh yea, you lied abuot what I wrote even though it's right there in black and white..
So you do what you always do. Insult people and skulk away. But you'll be back for one last shot...