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Topic: high ad rates, low freelancer's fee
| Author | Message |
| flipflap | Posted – 6/8/2006 9:30:44 AM | show profile Generally speaking, the larger the circulation, the more money a publication can afford to pay its freelance writers. Yet some trades with a low circulation compared to consumer mags can afford to pay high rates because their subscription fees are very high. Sometimes a couple of hundred dollars. What about ad rates--do they have any connection to pay rates? Question: Is there some kind of formula where you can look at what a pub is charging per-page for an ad and translate that into what they should be paying their writers per page? Especially if the writer's knowledge of the industry and caliber of work work is likely to attract new advertisers. Could be a a magic formula to negotiate higher fees. Or am I dreaming? I'm thinking about trades that have a circ. well under 10k and a sub rate somewhere in-between, say $50-$100? Usually I don't bother with these pubs, because I've been offered something like $100 per article, $250 tops for a long piece. Peanuts, compared to what theyre getting for an ad. |
| questoo1 | Posted – 6/8/2006 10:24:32 AM | show profile I think you'd be very hard pressed to find a cirmcumstance where and advertiser came on board because of a specific writer. Obviously the overall editorial quality is key & that overtime pulls the readers, which pull the advertisers, but not like adding one or two writers is going to pull an advertiser in the magazine persae. Also, when you are talking about larger circ magazine's, all manufacturing costs INCREASE proportional to circulation, so until things like paper, postage, production (larger circ more time on the presses which are often rented in time increments) are free you likely won't be able to make the connection. |
| dribbledrive1 | Posted – 6/8/2006 10:55:24 AM | show profile You're dreaming, to be frank. There really isn't any strong connection between ad sales or even profitability and freelance rates. That is like a socialistic assumption -- if we make more money, we share it equally with anyone. In reality, publications will usually spend as a little as they can to get the editorial quality they seek. A publication might make a lot of money simply because they have found a great, unique niche which appeals to advertisers, but they don't really need high editorial quality. In that case, they feel no need to pay a lot for articles. On the other hand, I write for some small trade publications and newsletters that pay high rates because their editorial is the reason they grab their readership. Before the dom.com bust, I wrote for one small-circulation magazine that paid $5 a word because they were targeting CEOs of large publications and needed great editorial to reach them. So the bottom line: don't assume you can guess the payment rates of publications. I write for a lot of trade magazines and dinky newsletters that look like they should pay peanuts, but pay $1 a word and more. And I have been approached by handsome glossy publications which do pay peanuts. < I'm thinking about trades that have a circ. well under 10k and a sub rate somewhere in-between, say $50-$100? Usually I don't bother with these pubs, because I've been offered something like $100 per article, $250 tops for a long piece. Peanuts, compared to what theyre getting for an ad.<< |
| westsidestory | Posted – 6/8/2006 2:59:39 PM | show profile I recall someone got huffy when I suggested that editorial fees are based on whim rather than circulation. But it's true. And it's true there is no correlation with ad rates, either. Ads are revenue. Writers are an "expense." Publishers are stingy. And, may I add, the "book rates" you find posted for advertising in any magazine are heavily discounted, depending on how desperate the publisher is to sell ads. |
| dribbledrive1 | Posted – 6/8/2006 3:41:49 PM | show profile I don't know if I'd call it "whim" exactly. More accurately, I'd say it's based on what level of quality a publication is trying to achieve. Now that can be all over the map. < Ads are revenue. Writers are an "expense." Publishers are stingy. And, may I add, the "book rates" you find posted for advertising in any magazine are heavily discounted, depending on how desperate the publisher is to sell ads.>> |
| flipflap | Posted – 6/9/2006 9:54:35 AM | show profile oh well, so it just a pipe dream after all. thanks for letting me know before I made a fool of myself in a pitch to the stingy editors of those trade magazines! I'm referring to the ones with a circ of under 10k and $50-$100 sub rate, who pay a measly $100-$250 for freelance articles. Chances are, you're right and they're not willing to pay more for quality work. Here's the deal: I write about and have expertise in a specific industry covered by half-dozen trades. I write for the top two pubs, which place a high value on expertise in the subject area and quality editorial, and pay very well. I'd like to convince one of the others that I'd be a great asset as a contributor or columnist. But they'd have to pay me more than they usually pay their writers. So I was going to say something about my work having the potential to bring in additional ad revenue. Basis for pipe dream: The editor of one of the trades once told me that the editorial quality (insight and analysis of industry) of my pieces helped bring in new ad revenue. |
| mumbo jumbo | Posted – 6/9/2006 10:37:10 AM | show profile Interesting that you write for competing trade pubs. I know of trade editors who won't use writers whose bylines appear in their competition. And I don't entirely disagree with that. I used to work for a trade pub that was often confused for another title in the same field. I would not have used writers who also worked for that pub--it would have compounded the confusion. |
| dribbledrive1 | Posted – 6/9/2006 11:22:07 AM | show profile Unless you can supply proof or specifics about how your writing will boost ad revenues, it probably won't have much an impact. Here is how the conversation would go, if I was the editor: You: "You should pay me a higher rate, because my work has the potential to bring in more advertisers." Me: "What advertisers you talking about, specifically?" You: "I don't really know. But an editor at another publication told me that advertisers did come in because of my writing." Me: "I'm afraid that's too vague for me to pay more based on it. But tell you what. If you come to me with the names of specific advertisers who will come into our magazines because you're writing for us, and it pans out, we can probably work out a deal." < Basis for pipe dream: The editor of one of the trades once told me that the editorial quality (insight and analysis of industry) of my pieces helped bring in new ad revenue. >> |
| flipflap | Posted – 6/9/2006 12:34:00 PM | show profile thanks, dribbledrive. I see what you mean. I'll have to give this some thought and come up with another script ;-) mumbo- I knew somebody would mention that. I should clarify that I cover different segments of the industry for the two trade pubs mentioned. The editors have not mentioned it, so obviously it doesn't bother them. It's not like I'm a contributing editor listed on the masthead--just a freelancer trying to make a living Let's say I write about oh, oranges for mag. no 1 and apples for mag 2. Well, mag no. 1 already had a writer whose beat was apples when I came along, so that was his/her turf. Mag no. 2 would never assign me a piece/get a pitch from me on oranges, because my beat for them apples. Someone else does oranges. If I start writing for mag no. 3, maybe I'll write about bananas;-) |
| mumbo jumbo | Posted – 6/9/2006 1:00:41 PM | show profile Got it. And all of a sudden I feel very hungry. Maybe an orange... |
| flipflap | Posted – 6/9/2006 1:29:33 PM | show profile PS- do you think it's unusual for a journo to write about different segments of an industry for competing trade pubs? |
| mumbo jumbo | Posted – 6/9/2006 2:25:44 PM | show profile If you have a regular column in both, I'd say that's unusual. If you do the occasional freelance assignment, well, then no. |
