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Topic: being forced to quit...
| Author | Message |
| photoop | Posted – 7/25/2006 8:39:06 PM | show profile has anyone ever been forced to quit? i'm unsure what to do about this situation. my editor is giving me a timeline and basically, i have three weeks to find a new job. yet i'm still expected to produce all of this work... what do i do? |
| waiting | Posted – 7/25/2006 8:54:27 PM | show profile being forced to quit not sure if it can be called "quiting". i worked at a mag once where the same thing happen to a co worker. it's very weird but i am not sure if you can do anything about it other than look for another work or enjoy the summer and collect unemployment. it seems like they are giving you a head up. did they discuss any pay? how long did you work for the company? there are certian things they do owe you. |
| Marie | Posted – 7/25/2006 10:39:32 PM | show profile Being forced to quit is like being laid off or fired. The company might be wording it this way to avoid paying you unemployment, which will never hold up. |
| overthehillwriter | Posted – 7/25/2006 10:43:16 PM | show profile | email poster definitely would suggest talking to an attorney or UI people or something. Some places, if you give two weeks notice and tell them you're going to start freelancing immediately, they'll give you two weeks pay and turn you loose which prevents that horrendous lameduck (that's Duck, with a D) two weeks. |
| overthehillwriter | Posted – 7/25/2006 10:43:20 PM | show profile | email poster definitely would suggest talking to an attorney or UI people or something. Some places, if you give two weeks notice and tell them you're going to start freelancing immediately, they'll give you two weeks pay and turn you loose which prevents that horrendous lameduck (that's Duck, with a D) two weeks. |
| caitlinkelly | Posted – 7/26/2006 9:53:40 AM | show profile Three weeks is pretty quick to get a new job lined up. Even if they fire you tomorrow, and you file your UI claim, you'll have to wait an initial week (NYS law, if you're in NY state) and than another two weeks to get your first check. Do you have enough cash in hand to get through that period? If they're firing you, why stay? I'd find an attorney stat and ask them what your legal rights are, then meet with HR. |
| Marie | Posted – 7/26/2006 10:27:35 AM | show profile Usually when they fire or lay you off, you leave immediately. If they're giving you the warning of a lay off, I would continue to keep working, because you'll earn extra money, which you'll need, on top of eventual unemployment (if you leave now, you'll lose three weeks of pay). I'd work as long as you can, again, only for the money, but don't quit. Remember, severance is not the law anywhere (it's definitely not the law in New York state). |
| belinda | Posted – 7/26/2006 11:30:12 AM | show profile Don't quit. Is this the prelude to a layoff? Is the timeline a performance-improvement plan? |
| waiting | Posted – 7/26/2006 11:42:30 AM | show profile i think that is a good question..prelude to a laid off. what is the reason for letting you go? i recently was laid off and had my questions about how the company did it. i went to the labor bureau and was told in ny, the company can fire/let go for no reason. as far as unemployment, most companies have to give it to you. even if you fight for it. as far as what a company has to give, there is a rule(the other person that was laid off with me fought the company for this) the standard is two weeks pay plus vacation time that was not used. Also if you were with the company for serveral years, they have to add on another weeks pay ie 5 years- 5 weeks pay. that is the experience i have had and people i know. |
| caitlinkelly | Posted – 7/26/2006 12:15:10 PM | show profile Marie is right; NYS employment is "at will" and they can, and do, fire you for any reason and, legally, for no reason. I'd make sure (by asking your editor, or better, HR who administers this paperwork), if you can collect your unemployment benefits if you are being fired without cause (i.e. embezzling or some egregious issue). Belinda's question is a good one....is there a paper trail on you establishing weeks or months of poor performance (and your inability to improve)? Severance is sometimes negotiable, and in some instances worth trying for, but will depend on a variety of factors, and a decent NYS labor attorney will know what they are. S/he won't sugarcoat your situation, but they know do what, if any, recourse you might have other than cowering in fear. The more accurate information you can gather, and quickly, the better off you will be in this crummy situation, which isn't that unusual. |
| Just.say.the.word | Posted – 7/26/2006 12:40:59 PM | show profile seeking visuals, what you're talking about is severance pay, not unemployment. The state government pays unemployment benefits if you're laid off (not fired for cause). Generally I think companies will rarely contest your ability to collect state unemployment benefits--it's not worth it to them to battle over this unless you did something REALLY awful at the company (which the original poster probably didn't since they haven't asked her to leave immediately). To the original poster: I'd keep working there until the bitter end (unless you find another job first and quit). Make them lay you off so you can collect unemployment and possibly severance (if you work for a big company you will most likely get some severance). Ask upfront: "what will happen in 3 weeks if I don't leave before then?" Make them spell it out. I was in the same position myself not long ago. It was really awful but I stuck it out, got a good severance package, and quickly found another great job after that. Hang in there! |
| bjoconnorfla | Posted – 7/26/2006 1:40:30 PM | show profile Negotiate You definitely need to clarify the situation (at least for us to help you). If you're being forced out/laid off, job is ending, whatever, you probably want to stay on get every penny you can collect. I don't see why you would be expected to do much more than help with immediate matters and leave things in good order for whomever will assume you duties. Part of your negotiating should be exactly what you need to deliver before you go. For example, do they need a "how to" memo outlining how to do your job? As part of that negotiation, you should discuss what kind of reference you can get with a future employer. If possible, get your boss to give you a letter of reference, and don't be afraid to negotiate what it says. This protects you from having your boss just say yes to get rid of you, then renegging on the reference later. Mostly, you want to walk out with whatever good relationships you can keep to help in your new job search and preserve your professional reputation. Plus as much money and benefits as you can grab, but that's already been dealt with here. Of course, it's absolutely unfair that you should be expected to paste a smile on your face and give this job your best effort right through to your last day when you're being shoved out the door, but take the long view: It's better for you to leave as good an impression as possible behind you. Good luck. |
| caitlinkelly | Posted – 7/26/2006 2:37:15 PM | show profile >As part of that negotiation, you should discuss what kind of reference you can get with a future employer. If possible, get your boss to give you a letter of reference, and don't be afraid to negotiate what it says. This protects you from having your boss just say yes to get rid of you, then renegging on the reference later....Mostly, you want to walk out with whatever good relationships you can keep to help in your new job search and preserve your professional reputation> Great point. In a calm(er) moment, (depending how big your company is), make a list of anyone else who can also be a reference, not just your immediate supervisor, and ask them as well, even by phone or email after work hours, so you don't visibly put them on the spot. It might be someone you've supervised or a colleague or someone in the production department you've worked well with. It's unlikely there's no one other than this one boss who knows what you can do and having a few others can be helpful. There are places that value 360-degree evaluations. Depending on why you're being fired, and your work there, colleagues can be quite helpful for emotional support, job leads, other contacts, even after you leave the building. So your challenge as long as you're around them is to stay sane, civil and pleasant -- and leave as many people with good memories of you as possible. How you handle the axe, which is stressful and unpleasant indeed, is being watched by others. And skip the "walk of shame", carrying your desk-in-a- cardboard-box to the curb! Have them FedEx it home for you. |
| SFElisaW | Posted – 7/26/2006 5:07:13 PM | show profile Yes, I went through something similar during the dotcom times. Talk about stressful! I was made to sign something saying that in exchange for saying I had quit I would be paid two month's severance. It seemed like paying me to lie! But if I didn't comply, they said they'd lay me off without any severance. The document said if I told anyone I was laid off they could sue me. At the time, I had a new boss and I thought it was happening to just me. Turns out they were laying off mid-level managers throughout the company and they didn't want the news to get out and have it affect the stock price. I was very stressed out about how the entire thing was handled and negotiated another month's severance. I would go have a word with the HR person and try to find out what is going on - whether your boss is out to get you (in which case he or she should be doing something more official in terms of notice) or if budget is disappearing. In any case, I'd try to negotiate more time and part-day schedules so you can get out and interview. Good luck - I'm sure you'll be better off at your next gig. I know I was. |
| SFElisaW | Posted – 7/26/2006 5:08:17 PM | show profile Important PS: I signed their silly piece of paper but was still able to collect unemployment. |
| waiting | Posted – 7/26/2006 7:01:42 PM | show profile to clear things up To clear up what I wrote: I was stating what companies should give as far as severence ie 5 years= 5 weeks. Different subject-Unemployment is paid for by the company's insurence and is controlled by the government. The company has to fork over the money to cover your unemployment. I just asked a labor person this. I always thought it was state or taxes but companies have insurence for this. I think we are all saying the same thing. You talk to some law people, finish the job out and work out an agreement so you don't get screwed. The letter is a good idea. |
| belinda | Posted – 7/26/2006 8:36:18 PM | show profile >>caitlin wrote: Belinda's question is a good one....is there a paper trail on you establishing weeks or months of poor performance (and your inability to improve)? << This is how some employees interpret performance improvement plans, when it is not what PIPs are. |
| Marie | Posted – 7/26/2006 10:53:48 PM | show profile Unemployment does come out of state taxes, but when companies have someone collecting, they pay something extra. The suggestions about lining up references is a great one. And if you do leave, on your last day go around an shake everyone's hand whom you worked with, even tangentially, and tell them how much you enjoyed working with them, and even recall some projects you did together. You'll be surprised at how forthcoming eveyone will be with help. Here's another thing. Those agreements you now almost always have to sign to get severance have become pretty standard. Most don't tell you to lie and say you quit, but that you waive any rights to sue. Here's a tip: You can almost always get more money out of them, often several thousand more. Whatever, you do, do NOT sigh right away if you're presented with one of these. You have several months (this is regulated by the law) to sign. Until you sign, you're kind of a loose cannon for the company. So hold off, and ask for more, or ask for more money right away, YOu'll be asked to sign away a lot, and that's worth something. And the company really wants you to sign so it can wrap your case up. But hold off. But again, your company doesn't have to give you any severance. So don't think money will necessarily be coming, other than what you're owed for your work. |
| waiting | Posted – 7/28/2006 4:26:39 PM | show profile Marie, Thanks for clearing that up about taxes. I always thought that but when I recently spoke to unemployment they told me it was the company's money. I thought it was kinda weird. |
