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Topic: how do you present editing experience?

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clairezulkey Posted – 9/7/2006 11:31:14 AM | show profile | email poster
Say you're an editor applying for a new job and your hirer wants to see examples of your work. How do you present physical proof of your editing prowess? (answers will probably be posted on mbtoolbox.com so email me if you want me to use your full name and link to your profile/site)

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Editor of MBToolBox
pentup Posted – 9/8/2006 12:37:54 PM | show profile
I'm bumping this up because I think it's a good topic and one I've often thought about.

In the past, I've generally submitted clips of articles I've edited accompanied by a description of what exactly I did. But I do have a hard time finding the right words to describe everything: often I feel like my accompanying description makes it sound like the whole thing was very easy, instead of, say, a demanding multi-week project. So far I've just assumed that hirers, since they're in the business, will understand the time involved in things like, "conceiving" an idea for a feature, "assigning and editing" copy and "collaborating with art" to come up with a design scheme and photography possibilities.

Any other ideas out there?
gimmemags Posted – 9/8/2006 2:34:30 PM | show profile
this is an excellent topic. As a copy editor, I don't really know how to show what I do. I still have pretty up to date writing clips because I'm allowed to freelance, but how do you show that you made a piece better short of holding on to copies of articles you edited?
janbrady1 Posted – 9/8/2006 3:09:40 PM | show profile
Yes--a great question. As an editor who rarely writes, I still feel compelled to write occasionally to have something to show on interviews--but should an editor really have to show current writing clips (unless their job, of course, will involve writing)? I feel it's expected, but perhaps I'm wrong? I suppose it shows one's style...
writesonwater Posted – 9/8/2006 4:34:50 PM | show profile | email poster
I ask if they would like to see a Word doc I have edited using the tracking feature (which I do for my clients anyway). Tracking is great, because it can end up looking like red ink was spilled all over the place.

Do this with a shoddy document -- fix the heck out of it.

I also have samples of the magazines I have proofed and fixed in my portfolio.

These clients are very generous references because they love what I do for them as well.

On your resume, in the summary up top (which replaces the old-fashioned objective) specify your skills -- spelling, grammar, punctuation, etc.

And don't be like my friend, who submitted a cover letter via email that said she had great spellling skills. (I'm not making that up.)
mailbag Posted – 9/8/2006 5:23:37 PM | show profile | email poster
Similar to writesonwater, only without the tracking mechanism - I have "before" and "after" scans (into pdfs) of work I've done... I either print out and bring along, or e-mail as pdf attachments. Two pages - easy to see the editing scribs :)
valentine Posted – 9/8/2006 5:32:39 PM | show profile
With the portfolios I've seen and in having mine critiqued lately, there seems to be a trend of providing a synopsis on the sample. So maybe a small text box if your sample is in Word or a label affixed to a sheet protector which describes what the project entailed--"this article came in with run-on sentences, over the word length and poor punctuation. I was able to cut the length and reduce errors to more closely fit the original assignment."
Hannah Posted – 9/8/2006 7:21:24 PM | show profile
I usually present three or so editing examples, each comprising the raw copy and final product, as well as a summary of the article's mission, early problems, and eventual improvements.
chucho Posted – 9/9/2006 10:21:04 AM | show profile
I think before and after is good. I use excerpts of the worst offenders, along with some full (but short) stories showing what was submitted to me and what came out.

I keep all originals and post-edited work so I can cherry pick the ones that most reflect my contribution to the final copy. Fortunately I work with ESL reporters, so the editing really shows up in the final copy compared to the original.

I imagine it can be difficult to show one's contribution to the copy when working with highly talented and experienced writers. But I suppose if you're surrounded by a lot of talent, you're probably working at a publication that speaks for itself on your résumé.
WritingEd Posted – 9/11/2006 1:18:14 PM | show profile
To show conceptual editing, I have presented samples of columns I started and/or better developed.

If I were interviewing now, I would do the same. I could also take examples of how an evergreen topic was covered in the past in our publication and how I have helped to make sure we cover it with fresh angles each additional time the topic comes up. Then I might show my assignment letter (since I'm told mine are done well--very detailed), the draft of the story that came in, and the finished piece, all laid out.
Little Fingers Posted – 9/12/2006 11:28:58 AM | show profile
Uh oh
I have struggled with this since I started working, but I actually never thought of using a Word document with the tracking feature. That is how I do most of my editing, so it would be easy to PDF a few pages to have as samples.

I used to work in book publishing, and in that field all you do is provide a list of the books you've worked on. I collect letters of reference from authors as well, because I think that makes a stronger impression of how I work as an editor than a list of titles. But in two years of freelancing no one has ever asked me for more than my list of projects and a few references, and it hasn't stopped me from doing well--I get more and more clients as my network of referrals grows.
Little Fingers Posted – 9/12/2006 11:34:58 AM | show profile
meant to add...
that my resume also lists the various aspects of my job while on staff as an Editorial Assistant. I added the word "Acquiring" because, unlike many book publishers, my department encouraged us to jump into work as an Editor as soon as we were ready. I started acquiring and editing titles within my first year on the job. As another poster wrote, I figure if I am applying for another Editorial Staff position, they will know what these job details mean.
It says :

ACQUIRING EDITORIAL ASSISTANT (6/00-5/04)
XXX, New York NY
Reading and evaluating manuscripts, acquiring and editing book projects (see list attached), copywriting, recruiting authors, assisting a senior editor and other staff in daily aspects of book publishing

writesonwater Posted – 9/12/2006 12:03:31 PM | show profile | email poster
This feedback is inspiring me to get a couple letters of reference...
pentup Posted – 9/12/2006 3:26:56 PM | show profile
Letters of reference
So do a lot of you here get letters of reference and just keep them on file? How long would you keep them on file before updating them?
Little Fingers Posted – 9/12/2006 3:56:14 PM | show profile
letters of ref
The oldest letter of reference I have is from an author whose nonfiction book I edited in 2002. I still use it because it speaks specifically about some of the ways I improved the book and what the author valued most. I have newer ones, too, but I tend to send reference letters with regard to similar topics/categories (i.e. fiction for potential fiction jobs), not necessarily how old they are.

I also have a Testimonials page on my website with shorter "letters" and/or excerpts of letters. That page alone has convinced several of my most recent clients to work with me.
flummoxed Posted – 9/13/2006 4:03:39 PM | show profile
why not just offer to edit something for them? just be clear that whatever they want you to edit should be fairly brief?not more than 3 or 4 pages?unless they're planning to pay you for your work!

most mag and book publishers looking for both freelance and full-time staff ask applicants to take an editing test, whether a job's for copy, line, or development editing.

i've found that employers interested in seeing editing samples have either never worked or have little experience working with an editor, which can be good or not so good
chucho Posted – 9/14/2006 10:03:09 AM | show profile
Offering to edit something, or editing something that has already been published (if you can find something in the target pub that makes you say to yourself: "I could have done a better job") has worked for me in the past.

Re. track changes: I rarely use it, but had the idea of using it for the purposes expressed here.

The only problem is creating those "tracked changes" documents if you don't use them in your everyday work.

I found it too time consuming to build editing samples with the changes tracked -- and the more changes you make (eg the more work you do on a story) the more of a mess you make out of the document until it becomes difficult to read the final copy without "accepting the changes" and simply comparing the "before" and "after" without the changes tracked.

So I found the time I was using creating samples with changes tracked wasn't worth it since a lot of people will simply "accept the changes" and compare the "before" and "after" in a way that's easy to read.

I suppose if you use the track changes feature regularly (so you don't have to build ones just for editing samples) there's no harm in sending them -- but don't forget to include a "before" without all the red ink and strikethroughs that makes the document difficult to read -- that would give you a "before," "during" and "after" rather than simply a "before" and "after." Not sure how much of a difference that actually makes, though.
writesonwater Posted – 9/14/2006 11:59:04 AM | show profile | email poster
I use the tracking feature all the time for a couple of my clients, and they like it because they send me the rough, I fix it and they can see what I did, along with notes. It's a little mini-history of the edits.

When I was editing publications I was EIC of, it wasn't necessary. But I really like it now.
Little Fingers Posted – 9/14/2006 12:18:53 PM | show profile
Tracking Changes
It also depends on the version of MS Word that you use. I use 2003, which has a view that puts all of the changes in the margins and leaves the actual text clean. If a word is deleted, for example, it's just gone...but a thin dotted line extends from where it was into the margin where a bubble says "deleted: X". This view is easier to read than the older versions, where all the strikethroughs and changes can clutter the document.
writesonwater Posted – 9/14/2006 12:53:45 PM | show profile | email poster
yes, mine is the later variety too. I wouldn't like the earlier kind.
keelosera Posted – 9/14/2006 6:43:13 PM | show profile
I have a standard sample I edited using Adobe Acrobat with embedded sticky notes. When the PDF is pulled up, it looks like the original layout with little icons wherever I made a comment or change. If you click on the icon, the comment comes up in a pop up box. Then whoever is reading it can just close the box when they're done reading the comment. There are alternate views too. It's quite handy. I've been meaning to put that sample on my website but I haven't gotten around to it.
keelosera Posted – 9/14/2006 6:43:37 PM | show profile
I have a standard sample I edited using Adobe Acrobat with embedded sticky notes. When the PDF is pulled up, it looks like the original layout with little icons wherever I made a comment or change. If you click on the icon, the comment comes up in a pop up box. Then whoever is reading it can just close the box when they're done reading the comment. There are alternate views too. It's quite handy. I've been meaning to put that sample on my website but I haven't gotten around to it.
keelosera Posted – 9/14/2006 6:43:55 PM | show profile
I have a standard sample I edited using Adobe Acrobat with embedded sticky notes. When the PDF is pulled up, it looks like the original layout with little icons wherever I made a comment or change. If you click on the icon, the comment comes up in a pop up box. Then whoever is reading it can just close the box when they're done reading the comment. There are alternate views too. It's quite handy. I've been meaning to put that sample on my website but I haven't gotten around to it.
textwoman Posted – 9/15/2006 3:21:07 PM | show profile
editorial experience
So many factors to hiring an editor.
More impt than showing an ability to line edit or reconstruct ms., is the editor's ability to:
work with cross-functional team (design, production, etc)
use market research (about customers) to inform editorial decisions
develop a concept and see it through (especially one that is tough to sell to sr. editors/managers)
use judgment and make a tough decision---like knowing when to kill something that isn't working
develop relationships with colleagues (finance, marketing, etc)
supervise/train others (if applicable)
be flexible--every place has a writing style--can you learn the house style quickly?
know the market, study the market, keep up with the market

Good examples of how you have done these things are very helpful when deciding on a candidate. They tell me a lot about your ability to work independently, your style of working, your potential on my team (especially how you would fit).
lt (editorial mgr)
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