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Topic: Quit or be Fired
| Author | Message |
| GottaGetOut | Posted – 1/28/2008 11:32:18 PM | show profile I've been at my current position for less than a year and I've been miserable the entire time, primarily because I'm under very inexperienced and communication-challenged managers. A few months ago I noticed that the e-mails were becoming strangely formal. Turns out they were building a case against me to document with HR. I received a verbal warning (disguised as an informal chat) so that put me on alert. I have a meeting this week to discuss this situation again and I think they may fire me. I have never ever had performance issues at a job so this situation has me at a loss. Plus the "performance issues" are things like spacing in internal documents all very very petty things. I don't want this on my record, so do I quit immediately? I understand that I won't be able to collect unemployment, but I will be okay financially for 1-2 months. I've had some great job interviews and I'm confident that I'll be receiving an offer before the end of the week, so it's a matter of timing. |
| candylilacs | Posted – 1/29/2008 3:48:06 AM | show profile The options are to be fired and then collect unemployment or quit and have to explain why you quit in a nonjudgmental or bashing way. Depending on your situation, the decision is yours to make. Either way, a firing is not the end of your career, nor is quitting. If you are choosing the fired route, then continue on. If you are wanting to quit, may I suggest giving a month's notice (so at least you get a few week's pay out of it)? However, for next time you will have to be careful to find a job that is a good fit for yourself. That means not something beyong your capabilities and with managers who can teach you something, including good communication. Good luck! ------ http://www.mswritesguide.blogspot.com |
| recovering_jersey_girl | Posted – 1/29/2008 9:27:49 AM | show profile One thing to keep in mind re. unemployment: It sounds like your co jut might be couching this as a performance issue so they can get out of paying you unemployment. Slimy, but it happens...and do you want your valuable job-hunting time to be tied up fighting for your unemployment $$? Honestly, if you can afford the financial hit, I would quit. Just my 2 cents. Good luck either way. |
| Hanschak | Posted – 1/29/2008 10:18:29 AM | show profile Given the ridiculous competition for media jobs right now, I would seriously recommend thinking twice before you jump out there. Since you only suspect there is something in the air, proceede accordingly; back up all communications with your managers so that you cover your own a** Don't let an unfair accusation stay unanswered (politely, of course). Firing someone and not paying unemployment is not easy for employers--don't think that is simply a matter of having some convenient claim against an employee's performance. Find your next job on your time not your company's. |
| westsidestory | Posted – 1/29/2008 11:14:06 AM | show profile My two cents: let them fire you (you can always just say "it was a bad fit") . But, keep looking aggressively for a new job NOW. And take the offer if you get it. On "their" time? Sure - you owe them nothing, they'll be glad to not have to pay the unemployment. Whatever you do, remember to keep your insurance via COBRA. If you've worked at least six months, you can carrry your health plan with you (you have to pay the premiums though) and this can keep you covered in the event the new job's health plan doesn't kick in for a few months. Keep it friendly, keep it professional - and never put anything negative in an email. Good luck! |
| JimmyG | Posted – 1/29/2008 11:22:15 AM | show profile I agree. If you show up to work every day, don't steal from the company and otherwise put in an honest effort, there's no way you could be denied unemployment, even if you were grossly incompetent. The onus is on the company to hire qualified individuals who fit their culture, and if things don't work out to their liking and they release you, it's up to them to pay your unemployment. You shouldn't get an argument here, and if you do, you'll still get unemployment unless and until they proved you didn't deserve it. And even if they somehow had a case against you, it's likely you'd have collected a couple months' unemployment by then (this happened to someone I know who actually quit and tired to get unemployment on the basis of being forced out by getting lower-and lower tasks--it didn't go in her favor, and she eventually had to pay back the amount she got, but it was at no interest, at least in Illinois). This means the worst that could happen is that the state gives you a no-interest loan to live on for a couple months. There is no stigma anymore for being fired or laid off. Employers with half a brain won't give a bad reference unless you were truly a bad seed. |
| s_sanaru | Posted – 1/29/2008 11:35:14 AM | show profile Don't quit until you have a signed offer in your hand! Trust me, its a jungle out there! |
| Cyrus | Posted – 1/29/2008 11:47:21 AM | show profile Just to clarify what Caddy wrote, in some states -- including New York -- you won't be eligible for unemployment if you were fired for poor performance. I can't remember exactly how they classify it, but depending on what your employer puts on the form they file with the state, you'd have to appeal to the state DOL before you'd get ANY benefits. As far as whether you quit or get fired, if you walk out the door on your own, you can truly say you quit and even though employers rarely do anything other than confirm dates of employment when called, you also have the confidence of knowing they probably won't lie and say they fired you. I realize this sounds grand to say when someone's worried about all the things associated with parting with a job unexpectedly, but sometimes there's something very gratifying about keeping your principles in these situations. I always included being treated fairly on that list when I worked for others. If somewhere's a hellish place to work and has a high turnover rate, odds are there's nothing you can do to right the ship anyway. ------ Cyrus Afzali Astoria Communications www.astoriacomm.com |
| can't say | Posted – 1/29/2008 11:55:17 AM | show profile Back when I was a manager, a few years ago, I had to fire someone for poor performance. I worked closely with HR to do it "properly." That meant giving the person time to improve his work performance, I think a month or so. I don't know if that's the law, but that's the procedure I had to follow (it was not a union situation). So maybe you'll be given the same opportunity. That will buy you time. I agree with the posters who said it's a jungle out there. I wouldn't be so quick to quit. Best of luck! |
| AWC | Posted – 1/29/2008 12:50:11 PM | show profile Sorry to hear about your situation. I guess I would say that if you can afford it, feel free to quit. It definitely will make you feel better to leave on your own terms. But if you can't afford it -- after all, you don't have a firm job offer yet -- stick around and do the best you can in your remaining time left in this position. Remember, getting fired is not the end of the world, and I wouldn't worry about it being a black mark on your "record." These days, no company can afford to speak badly about a former employee who was let go. There are so many legal ramifications involved, that most companies are shying away from supplying any info (good or bad) about former employees. |
| inkblot | Posted – 1/29/2008 1:08:21 PM | show profile QUIT IMMEDIATELY Job or no job, get out. Now. My friend was in the same situation as you and he chose to quit working for some oppressive Gannett fascists who had it in for him for months. He beat them to the punch -- he sensed the phone call, received at home from bossman, to meet managers the next day in the HR office early in the morning was for his firing. (He was already on probation). So he met management in the morning, as scheduled, and before they could begin, he handed over a letter of resignation. His desk was packed within a half hour. Best career decision he's ever made. His new job, in the same field, print media, pays him thousands more and management at his current job are actually functional and smart. The other place was a joke. However, here's the other side of that: --he searched for 3 months before being offered another job --he borrowed money from his parents to pay bills while he was unemployed --his job search cost $700 (mileage to job interviews, mailing more than 100 clip packages) --he had to move to another state --he went to a lot of dud job interviews at some sketchy places that didn't want to meet his minimum salary requirements But everything worked out in the end (so far). It was tough, but quitting worked. A big thing with him quitting is it gave him confidence in job interviews. He felt it gave him the upper hand to say he quit rather than waffle -- or lie -- about how his job ended so abruptly at his last job. |
| foodlit | Posted – 1/29/2008 1:31:06 PM | show profile Honestly, from an hr perspective, I would advise you to quit. Do it professionally, so that you leave on good terms. If you are 'fired', that is very difficult to overcome. Even if it's not fair, you could lose out on some great jobs because people are nervous about it. I've seen it happen. However, if you quit and do it well, just say to them, "This doesn't seem to be the best fit and I think the best thing is for me to move on." Then see what they say. Maybe they'll be pleased and will work with you to call it a 'layoff' and then you'll be eligible for unemployment. Good luck. If a job is making you that miserable you will be amazed how much better you'll feel immediately after you leave. Pam |
| Jill of all trades | Posted – 1/29/2008 1:45:04 PM | show profile I was actually "laid off" the way Pam described. Got severance and unemployment. It gave me time to find a job I actually wanted. Give as long a notice period as you can stomach (a month, as someone suggested, is good) and start sending out that resume, networking, looking for freelance stuff and signing up with a temp agency or two. Good luck. It really blows, but it's not the end of the world. You're better off without those jerks! |
| observer | Posted – 1/29/2008 2:27:14 PM | show profile allot of great advise has been given here so I have little to add. However, one comment I have is a firing is usually done without the employee expecting it and there is never a meeting set up ahead of time. I've seen it done here many times where the Manager just approaches the employee and asks if they can come to the Manager's office to 'speak' with them. Upon arriving at the Manager's office, the employee is greeted with the HR Director and, well, you know the rest. If they have set up a meeting for later in the week this could be to discuss your preformance and this could be a verbal warning or not. My thought is that you may have more time than you realize. Here in California, the firing process is quite formal - first, a verbal warning, next a written warning and then the final firing. Best of luck to you. |
| LiteratinDC | Posted – 1/29/2008 6:00:35 PM | show profile Don't do it... Yeah, I'd say you're being a little overconfident about this market, your credentials and these great job interview you've had. I mean maybe everything would fall into place for you and you'd have a job in a week or two --- but since this is the real world, it probably won't happen like that. For competitive positions, it can take months if not upwards of a year. You take a real chance quitting this job before you've got something better. |
| darkfire | Posted – 1/29/2008 6:23:24 PM | show profile If you hate it, and they don't appear to like you all that much, quit. It will give you greater confidence in the job interviews later on. It's always a jungle out there. I have quit, been laid off, and been fired, from jobs. The worst was a familiar story - other managers had it in for me for months, I went through the long, formal case-building process, and then I got the boot. It was miserable, and left me wondering how employable I was for a long while. The reality was that the job, the company and I were a bad fit for each other. I also searched long and hard, and ended up moving where I found something VASTLY better, with better pay, better people, and a chance to advance my skills. In the end, there is no loyalty in business. The question is, when the relationship is no longer profitable for both, who is left holding the bag: you or them? |
| GottaGetOut | Posted – 1/29/2008 10:31:35 PM | show profile I quit Thanks for all of the comments. I went in this morning and gave a two week notice. I weighed the pros and cons of staying and realized that short of new bosses and new assignments (neither of which will happen) I'd be miserable and it just wasn't worth it. I also had several co-workers congratulate me since even they noticed that I was the scapegoat for a lot of things and treated differently. I feel like a huge weight has been lifted! |
| voracious reader | Posted – 1/29/2008 11:06:08 PM | show profile Good Luck! Before you leave, ask your colleagues if prospective employers can contact them for recommendations. |
| foodlit | Posted – 1/30/2008 9:55:11 AM | show profile Congratulations! And best of luck in finding a great new job. :) Pam |
| Marie | Posted – 1/30/2008 1:12:58 PM | show profile Good advice. Get references line up before you leave, and find out what your company officially reveals to future employers. Then spend the two weeks looking for other work--staff and freelance (freelance might be easier to land quickly, so don't hesitate to grab that). Good luck. And do line up at least one reference, ideally from someone in a more senior position than you (it doesn't have to be your direct boss). |
| Metro Writer | Posted – 1/30/2008 4:06:56 PM | show profile You got lots of good advice. If you tender your resignation before being fired, great. If the opposite happens, don't worry. You can always claim there was an internal restructuring or reassignment of responsibilities. Everyone understands that. Your record won't be stained. As for unemployment compensation, I know someone who was forced to resign. She collected unemployment checks because even the people at the DOL understood what happened and the employer could not successfully defend himself without practically admitting that he wanted her out because she already hit 65. |
