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Topic: Frustrated with editors
| Author | Message |
| Mirage | Posted – 3/28/2008 8:04:52 PM | show profile ...or switches to one of her psyeudonyms to write a post "agreeing" with the qunester posts. In the exact same distinctive style as qunester, of course. |
| intraining | Posted – 3/28/2008 8:05:41 PM | show profile Good thing the successful freelancers I know didn't take "no" for a final answer, or let the fear of becoming "annoying" stop them from resubmitting. That's a surefire way to ensure that you'll remain a starving writer. |
| seeattleme | Posted – 3/28/2008 8:09:13 PM | show profile Been there, I cannot count the times my ideas have been exactly right. So much so they show up --with my art suggestions and headline and dek suggestions --in the pages of national magazines. I have worked as an assistant AND an editor so I know what goes on. Where have YOU been published, since you claim my "wares" are not right for "your " publication? (A TRADE, by chance? Custom publishing? I don't bother with those . Never had to, actually, my first clip was in Mademoiselle. Ever.) My wares are SO right I have been asked again and again for MORE information from editors interested in them. Occasionally, those stories get assigned to staff writers about eight months down the line. Occassionally, they show up in the magazine a year or two later. Often, I wait and wait and sell them to competing publications after nearly a year, to get a call from the first editor angry because I didn't wait for her to decide and didn't TELL her I sold it to the competitor (like I'm going to do that! Again, I'll mention it yet again, Two May issues of Mademoiselle and Cosmo with matching stories, " Six Guys To Do Before You Say "I Do." Whatever, I don't have to deal with it anymore... Assuming the reason I am complaining about editors is because I have problem relationships with them --or problems getting published --is awfully ignorant, since you don't know who I am or who I have written for/ write for now. I get pissed at this behavior the same way kids who grew up in bad homes get pissed at parents who abuse their kids in the supermarket. Yes, I was there. I'm not anymore. It pisses me off that other freelancers --who on ANY level of comparision fare far worsee than employed editors--have to put up with this. And yes, I was an editor, too. But I took care NEVER to ignore freelancers, or their queries. And I'd get them from teenagers who didn't know how to spell. Seventy a day (anyone who has edited a teen magazine KNOWS how teenagers are, utterly devoted to their magazines ...and THEY weren't psycho about hearing "no". I find it REALLY hard to believe there are SOOOO many adult freelancers out there that poor overworked, undercompensated editors can't be bothered with a two line, "No thanks," response). Like I said, rationalize it all you want. Your defenses and rationalizations only prove my point that this is unacceptable behavior and that you realize it, deep down. |
| seeattleme | Posted – 3/28/2008 8:11:09 PM | show profile And Mirage, idiot, once again, when I switch my post name all my names switch. Look it up for yourself. Why are you obsessed with my post names? Freak! Freak! Get a life. Get laid. Get a cat. Something. |
| Mirage | Posted – 3/28/2008 8:15:17 PM | show profile I should get a life? I am not the one who has multiple screennames on MB which I switch to to "agree" with other posts I've written. How do I know this? Maybe from one of those famous cocktail parties you're always talking about, where we editors sit around laughing about how we steal all your fabulous ideas and reassign them to our Ivy league friends. Have a nice weekend. |
| seeattleme | Posted – 3/28/2008 8:16:51 PM | show profile And Mirage, no I don't spend a lot of time proofing or spell checking my posts because I HAVE A LIFE and for me this is a recreational board. You know nothing of where I've published or whom I've written for. You are speculating and assuming, and you are wrong. Out of curiousity, what's so WRONG with CAPITALIZING for EMPHASIS when your COMPUTER can't put type in bold or italics? WHAT'S so WRONG with it ANYWAY? DO PEOPLE NOT do this? BECAUSE I KNOW RAPPERS DO. You know, those losers of self expression. |
| seeattleme | Posted – 3/28/2008 8:18:56 PM | show profile I know youa re lying because I have not one time switched a screename and agreed on anything I've said before under another screen name. But I will check with Mediabistro and see that there is no breach of confidentiality, as that is what you are hinting at. P.S.. Unless you live in Seattle you are not attending the cocktail parties I am talking about. |
| seeattleme | Posted – 3/28/2008 8:22:10 PM | show profile oh! and thank you for calling my style "distinctive." |
| writerandeditor | Posted – 3/28/2008 9:04:54 PM | show profile If I publish a magazine about cows and you send me a pitch about dictionaries, I don't usually respond with a "no thanks." If you can't be bothered to pick up on the fact that we publish stories about cows, I can't be bothered to respond to you. If, however, I publish a magazine about cows and you send me a pitch about cows, but I'm still not interested, I will send back a "thanks, but no thanks." The problem that I have is that most writers are sending me stories about dictionaries. And I have a hard time believing that all of the writers on here who bemoan the rudeness of editors have never sent one of those dictionary pitches. |
| dribbledrive1 | Posted – 3/28/2008 9:47:05 PM | show profile I think it goes beyond that. If you are selling anything, you have to expect a lot of the people you are trying to sell to will be rude, apathetic, and don't feel any need to be particularly pleasant or polite to you. Successful salespeople don't worry about stuff like that. They focus on actions and attitudes that will increase their likelihood of a sale. --But editors do not work for freelancers, it's the other way around. And when you're selling a product, you have to be prepared for rejection.-- |
| Team America | Posted – 3/28/2008 11:38:44 PM | show profile The Last Word Seems to me this could be a permanent thread. Who could possibly write the last word? If you've done your homework and really understand the pub/editor/feature; if you've got a great idea; if you've done your research and written a great pitch you do deserve a simple rejection. No one should ever stalk, but there is such thing as righteous persistence. Think carefully about the follow up calls you make, the emails you send and the messages you leave. If they don't respond after a few attempts, they aren't going to respond and you let it go. Try to imagine yourself on the other end of your communications. How would that communication make you feel? If you'd think you were a jerk, then don't do it. The editor is a person too. On the other hand, I am certain that I've won certain projects through sheer persistence. If you really are facing long periods between pitch and response that?s an open invitation to pitch multiple pubs in parallel. First to say "yes" wins. If pubs are stealing your pitches... I don't know what to say... It's happened to me, but has been an extremely rare occurrence. The few examples I can think of were not things I really cared much about. I wonder if this behavior would be avoided if you developed a relationship with a magazine/editor before sending a pitch inwhich you were trully invested. I can't see editors stealing from people they know. This is a longwinded way of saying maybe it's best to pitch FOB stuff first, establish a track record of success (and mutual respect) before you pitch things that are really important to you. It would seem you would want to keep seminal ideas close and only share them with editors you know will treat them with respect. I'll stop now; I can hear the violins... or is that the gallows' rope swinging in the breeze? |
| D_S | Posted – 3/29/2008 4:30:20 AM | show profile I only follow up on rejections if the editor really liked the idea (but could not use it for some reason) and asked to pitch more in the future. I never use neutral rejections to establish dialog or send more pitches. |
| dribbledrive1 | Posted – 3/29/2008 3:45:07 PM | show profile Well, it's a pretty weak argument that an editor should send a rejection to a pitch to encourage the writer to send more pitches that he might want to buy. Generally, I think editors are more likely to discourage pitches than encourage them, because considering pitches from people they don't know tend to not be a great use of time. --So because you rejected one idea, that means the writer will never be able to pitch something that may fit and *gasp* ultimately sell? Lets hope the writers at your magazine always have a steady flow of absolutely amazing ideas so that you'll never have to look to freelancers.-- |
| PluckyPane | Posted – 3/29/2008 4:45:21 PM | show profile editors, stop feeding the fire. no matter what you say, do or post here, you will always be the bastard for not doing enough to make these salespeople happy. the best analogy was the one about the resume. even when the job is posted do people rarely get a response back. and when you call and still don't get a response, what do you do? you move on to the next instead of posting on this board that so and so was an idiot for not responding back. you effing freelancers think that you are DUE something that you're not. freaking unbelievable. quite your whining about making a living and bills to pay. if it's too hard for you to be a freelancer then get a staff position. it's amazing how the freelancers on here who never complain seem to be making a living. why don't you check with them and see how they're doing it right. oh yeah, they're not on here complaining. they're getting over the no response and making a sale elsewhere. |
| mumbo jumbo | Posted – 3/29/2008 5:56:49 PM | show profile I really hate the complaints about stolen ideas. I often get multiple pitches on the same basic idea from freelancers and staff writers. Usually it's a service twist on something in the news ("What XYZ means to you..."). Obviously in those cases the staff writer will get the assignment. But the unknown freelancer will believe that I stole his or her idea. And probably rant here about it. |
| kitty54 | Posted – 3/30/2008 10:07:30 AM | show profile I agree it is annoying with no response, but you just have to keep it moving. No response is usually the answer and then sometimes it isn't. I pitched to a publication on Feb 1st and followed up Feb 8th. This week the editor assigned me a feature story that had nothing to do with what I originally pitched. There was another situation where I pitched to an editor, she asked me to refine my ptich, once I did, I didn't hear an answer. Then I ptich to a magazine she replied asking me to send some clips and she passed on my original ptich but then asked me to be apart of thier freelance team. With that I think patience helps it took me a long time to realize that. Also as other posters said, put yourself in their shoes, maybe there was a bad experience with saying no. Many people can't take NO at face value. I just consider no answer my answer and have faith that something better will come along. |
| TheSecondShift | Posted – 3/30/2008 5:10:12 PM | show profile And this isn't rude? There was another situation where I pitched to an editor, she asked me to refine my ptich, once I did, I didn't hear an answer.>> And to me, this is a problem and I'd like to hear from our editors on whether or not they think this is acceptable? When you decide to ask for more information, this doesn't mean that you are committed. But you have now entered a conversation. After receiving said info, if you've changed your mind, isn't the considerate thing to do is say "Thank you, but we've decided to pass."? I mean, is it that hard, really? And yet, this happens quite a bit. And when I encounter it, I decide that the ed obviously has no respect for my time so it may not be good to work with them anyway. But seriously, isn't this just one area that could easily be solved by one sentence? |
| InsomniacNOT | Posted – 3/30/2008 5:53:00 PM | show profile Yes it is rude although it's unlikely it could be solved by one sentence and not still be rude. The fact is in a lot of these cases, there *is* just nothing you as a freelancer can do about it. So you have to come up with your own work-around solutions and figure out how you are going to manage under circumstances when many editors are non-responsive. Venting is fine as long as you realize nothing you say will change the other person's behaviour. You can only use the tips you pick up to change yours/ |
| writerandeditor | Posted – 3/30/2008 9:04:55 PM | show profile As an editor, I do think requesting more information and then not following up is rude. You've displayed some semblance of interest -- it's the least you can do to decline the offer. |
| mumbo jumbo | Posted – 3/30/2008 10:31:50 PM | show profile I agree that it's rude. I'd never ask a writer to do more work and not give him/her the assignment. Often I'll do some research myself to see if the story is right for my book. |
| seeattleme | Posted – 3/30/2008 11:36:39 PM | show profile I think that acknowlege ment (that it is rude and not considered acceptable behavior) is all most freelancers are asking for on this board. WhatEVER their screenname happens to be. |
| seeattleme | Posted – 3/30/2008 11:40:06 PM | show profile Obviously (again, again, again, for the twelve thousanth tie DUH DOY and DUH) none of this applies to freelancers who submit pitches that are in now way shape or form applicable to the magazine's content. Come on people. Let's get beyond the obvious. Obviously, freelancers who have neverr ead the magazine don't deserve a response. But a freelancer who has read the magazine, submitted a pitch, and been asked for MORE information deserves a response. AT the very LEAST. Caps (and typos) intended. Fully, emphatically, and unapolegetically. |
| dribbledrive1 | Posted – 3/30/2008 11:56:32 PM | show profile It's rude, but I encounter this all the time. Not from editors, as much as from corporate clients and agents. In the business world, unfortunately, saying no by non-response has become very common. --Obviously (again, again, again, for the twelve thousanth tie DUH DOY and DUH) none of this applies to freelancers who submit pitches that are in now way shape or form applicable to the magazine's content. Come on people. Let's get beyond the obvious. Obviously, freelancers who have neverr ead the magazine don't deserve a response. But a freelancer who has read the magazine, submitted a pitch, and been asked for MORE information deserves a response. AT the very LEAST. Caps (and typos) intended. Fully, emphatically, and unapolegetically.-- |
| gossipeuse | Posted – 4/1/2008 4:20:48 AM | show profile There's a difference between freelance writers and other salesmen. If you're a door-to-door salesman, you know you're rejected as soon as the door slams in your face, if you're a telemarketer, you know as soon as someone hangs up, etc. Freelance writers just want to know they've been rejected, so they don't have to spend several days in limbo. And to anyone who tells them "get a staff position," I'm guessing they can't find staff positions--or they have a staff position and need extra money. Is there anyone here who chose freelance over staff? Seriously, I'd be surprised if people did that. |
| HisGirlFriday | Posted – 4/1/2008 10:38:24 AM | show profile I think at some point, if you want to break into glossies ,you just have to accept that this is the way it is and it's really freakin' hard to get your foot in the door. Of course, more than one writer is going to come up with the same story idea, of course it can take months for decisions, of course editors will rely on their stable (neigh!) vs freelancers. If you want to get into the big mags, suck it up like dribble says and just keep trying. If not, then give it up and find another niche. After a few attempts at the big mags (and a few horror stories, like everyone else describes) I decided it just wasn't worth it for me. It's not the mag editors' fault and I'm certainly good enough to do the work. It's just not how *I* want to expend my energies. No one can take advantage of you without your permission. |
