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Topic: I'm about to lose my cool!
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| snappiness | Posted – 5/20/2008 9:42:55 AM | show profile You know, people talk about what a tough industry this is and how hard it is to "make it" as a writer. But this thread is making me realize who is doing the complaining. I never found it hard. I mean, I had to hustle, but if you hustle you can make it. I guess it's the non-hustlers who whine. Hey, more work for me, right? My brother in law is a chef. He says that whenever anyone asks him about becoming a chef he tries to talk them out of it. "You don't want to be a chef, it's too hard, it's a nightmare, the jobs suck, you never see your family." I was aghast -- how could he be so negative about a career he loves? He said, "Hey, if he really wants to be a chef then nothing I say will stop him." His point being that it's a super competitive and challenging industry and only the hardcore fighters make it. I'm thinking it's the same with journalism. |
| WordyBird | Posted – 5/20/2008 10:50:56 AM | show profile "Rent: $450 Utilities: $100 for a month Cable: Skip it until next month Phone: $60 Groceries: $100 for two weeks Gas: $100 for two weeks I'll throw in another month's rent, and you're at $1260. That'll carry you through the first two weeks, and by then you're getting a paycheck. " Sorry, but no. I'm wagering the OP has a cell phone. Also, you're forgetting "start-up" costs such as that initial run to the grocery for everything from trash bags to deodorant to toothpaste--things you don't need to replace every week but must be stocked in the cupboard at first. What about prescriptions? Those don't transfer state-to-state. Solved easily enough if his or her doctor will call in a scrip to a pharmacy in another state, but what insurance will cover that? If the person is too old to be a dependent on his or her parents' plan, he or she will need insurance or have to fork over the cash. And you still haven't accounted for actually getting there. Flying or train? You need a ticket. U-Haul or movers? You need anywhere from $500 to $1700 just to go from, oh, say D.C. to Long Island with a 1-BR apartment. It goes by mileage, and no matter what kind of estimate movers give you, it ALWAYS runs a couple of hundred more, and then there's tip. And finally, you're assuming a lot if you assume someone will apply for, interview for, land, *and* get paid for a job in a brand new city within two weeks. I just moved in September. Yes, Long Island isn't cheap, but other places I considered are much less expensive than D.C. (for example, a suburb of Madison, Wisc.), and still, $1,500 is *quite* unrealistic. I put a lot of time and effort into deciding whether and what to sell versus move, the likelihood of getting a job quickly, cost of living, and my own ability to float myself with freelancing or temping, and I'm trying to help this person avoid getting in over his or her head only to end up working at McDonald's. And even then, there's no guarantee. I quit the job I started in October for a number of reasons, but when I turned in my resignation, the boss told me they were going to lay me off in the next round of cuts, anyway. That was in April, and while I've had some strong interest and a couple of offers, the pay rates are very low and freelancing is drying up. In a smaller city, that could become an issue very quickly for someone early in his or her career. So challenge away, but I've been through it recently, I'm much further along in my career than the OP and have far more options and connections yet am still doing creative financing to stay afloat, and I'm hoping the OP takes at least some of what the rest of us are saying about this under advisement before beating him or herself up after being told to move to a Third-World country. |
| WordyBird | Posted – 5/20/2008 11:21:51 AM | show profile "Even though I live with my parents I STILL HAVE BILLS! I pay rent (in NYCHA, if you have ANY kind of income, you must pay some rent, even if you temp!). I buy my own food, clothes (from the $10 store) and so forth. A person has to really think about just jumping up and moving in a recession." I think you are wise to feel that way. There are a lot of expenses that I left out (car registration fees, new car insurance, gas in addition to gas for moving, student loans if you have them, credit card bills if you have them) and I could go on all day. Suffice to say that your gut doesn't lie. If you have reservations about getting an a car and just going, your gut is telling you something. Only YOU know your current financial situation. For some, it would be worth the risk, for others, no. For now, I would suggest that if you do stay, you bite the bullet and try to get an administrative job somewhere in publishing. You CAN work with a headhunter for that, as many, many headhunters place administrative assistants. Do you know Word, Excel, and PowerPoint? If not, do so. Most companies try to hire from within, and if you are already in a decent company, when the economy gets better and jobs open up, you'll be right there and everyone will already know your work ethic and personality. In the meantime, it's really not bad money if you are living at home with your parents--and even if you're not. |
| mkelly | Posted – 5/20/2008 11:27:55 AM | show profile I wouldn't hire you either, WordyBird. |
| westsidestory | Posted – 5/20/2008 11:41:53 AM | show profile don't leave NY Ghostwriter, while a lot of the advice you have been getting as far as job-hunting is good, I have to weigh in to tell you to stay in NY if you are already living there. (FYI, I moved to NYC right out of school and my first apartment was in the barrio.) I can't for the life of me understand why people are telling you to move out of NYC when tens of thousands of recent graduates in other parts of the country are going cross-eyed trying to figure out how to afford an apartment in New York. Living here already (with family support group) is like your piece of the rock; it is a basis that will allow you to launch successfuly and it gives you an advantage. I do understand your frustrations in not being able to get a job, when I first moved here I wanted a job in TV, and believe me back before when there were only 7 channels it wasn't an open door. The best advice (which I think someone mentioned above) is to try to get a job that is somehow related to the area of journalism you'd like to cover. You may have to try two or three entry-level jobs before you find a good fit. New York has tons of little tiny publications that need staff. Chains laying off staff need freelancers. Two places to check would be the Times Ledger Newspaper group in Queens and pitching freelance to Time Out NY. The pay is crap but the clips usually come out pretty well. A journalism background is not wasted. And, as for your "branding" - in your case I'd say yours might not initially be based on skill, but on the fact that you're already a native New Yorker and have local knowledge some from the Midwest won't have. Go with your strength, which is that base that is your current home. Good luck, try to relax, it will happen. |
| seeattleme2 | Posted – 5/20/2008 12:22:22 PM | show profile finally, as Alan Richman once said (the foood writer/journalist nominated for about 5,0000 National magazine Awards, as well as others), every writer must leave New York at some point in order to write well. "Every writer has got to get out of New York for a period to write well. Period. Too many writers come to NY or stay in NY to write and their writing remains the same unless they get out at some point and live somewhere else." In his case, it was Vietnam. You could try covering iraq as a stringer for some news organization or chain. Your attitude would tank your career here in NYC but it might serve you well there. |
| onmyown | Posted – 5/20/2008 12:33:00 PM | show profile I'm with mkelly. I wouldn't hire any of these whiners. They rebut every sensible suggestion. They don't know how to apply for a job at Macy's. So how are the OP and WordyBird and jseconds going to find the parent of a child who was just murdered or the mother of someone who just shot up a schoolyard? Or how are they going to track down a politician who doesn't want to talk? Geez, this post would be funny if it wasn't so sad and disgusting. There is a major sense of entitlement in this generation (at least among these posters). And I won't go into my own story--starting out with literally nothing except loans and borrowed furniture--because it will fall upon deaf ears. |
| PluckyPane | Posted – 5/20/2008 12:37:59 PM | show profile good greif. guidance counselors failed you? were you expecting them to come to you and help you? still to this day i use my career services department at my alma mater and still get great leads. i said in one of my other posts how to look for jobs outside the industry. sit down and think about what you like to do. most careers require good writing or reporting skills. a degree in journalism does not mean you are disqualified for jobs in other fields. every field requires logical thinkers and clear communicators. some fields will require a field-specific degree like engineering or medicine, but the sky's the limit with other non-tech fields. reporting skills=good phone manners, tenacity, able to handle muliple requests writing skills=practically any job that requires written communication, including pr and journalism if you can't do this alone, then go to your career services office and talk to a counselor. he/she can help you get a job, any job, that will get you employed. my boss at the pr agency i work for has a degree in horticulture. he's doing pr. he used his skills as a horticulture expert (even though his expertise is limited to his garden; he never worked in the field) to land some major garden center accounts. you see how it works? |
| seeattleme2 | Posted – 5/20/2008 1:04:54 PM | show profile PLucky PLane is right, the more the off wall or un-English related your degree is, the better off you'll be on the hiring markey. Here's a thought: Join the Peace Corp. Learn a different language, travel to a Third World country, do some good, you come back to NYC and organizations will be falling all over themselves to hire you. If I could do it all, over, that's what I would do. |
| WordyBird | Posted – 5/20/2008 1:36:48 PM | show profile | email poster MKelly "I wouldn't hire you either, WordyBird." How about you address me off-board with this? Because frankly, your comments sound like you have a personal problem with me, and I doubt anyone here is interested in commentary like the above. We're all sick of the little flame wars here. Either talk to me directly about your issues, or be professional about it and hush your snittiness. |
| mkelly | Posted – 5/20/2008 1:41:11 PM | show profile Rock on, OnMyOwn. Couldn't have said it better myself, especially the part where you say you agree with me. |
| WordyBird | Posted – 5/20/2008 1:47:23 PM | show profile Onmyown "So how are the OP and WordyBird and jseconds going to find the parent of a child who was just murdered or the mother of someone who just shot up a schoolyard? Or how are they going to track down a politician who doesn't want to talk? Geez, this post would be funny if it wasn't so sad and disgusting. There is a major sense of entitlement in this generation (at least among these posters)." Actually, I am in my 40s and have 20 years of experience, OMO. Guess you missed where I mentioned that I have more experience and connections than the OP. You appear to have missed the fact that I am getting offers, as well. Might want to brush up on your backgrounding skills, there. Anyway, I'm disagreeing with what I see as inaccurate financial information based on my own experience, having just been through an interstate move myself. The OP is welcome to consider or disregard at will. If others disagree, that's fine, but this is a board for professionals, and it appears that a few people here have forgotten that fact. Then again, unprofessional behavior on the part of others just broadens the options for those of us who know how to behave in public. Thank you, drive through. |
| jobhunter08 | Posted – 5/20/2008 2:17:13 PM | show profile To Plucky- Exactly how many Gen Yers do you socialize with on a regular basis? To Grateful Deadline - I stand corrected then, however, I'd be interested in knowing the moving costs with the gas prices factored in. As seeattleme and WordyBird recognize, it is very expensive to relocate nowdays. Clearly more expensive than many people here realize. I just noticed someone said rent "$450". What is this, the 1980s? I would kill to see rent for $450 in a metro area. |
| foodlit | Posted – 5/20/2008 2:28:23 PM | show profile Ghost, You sound like a spoiled brat. So many people here have taken time to give you considered advice and you respond with capital letters and a temper tantrum. Adjust your attitude and you might have better luck with everything in your life, especially the job search. If you get this angry on a message board with people who are trying to help you, how are you acting on job interviews? Grow up, and do something other than complain. |
| mkelly | Posted – 5/20/2008 3:03:36 PM | show profile Keep pace, JobHunter-- rent at $450 is in the middle of nowhere, not a metro area. The whole point of this discussion is that newbies should be moving away from metro areas to get their reporter's sealegs. (WordBird excepted, of course, who seems to think Long Island is the middle of nowhere. Culturally, yes, but not at all on-point with the advice the rest of us are giving.) |
| PluckyPane | Posted – 5/20/2008 3:38:13 PM | show profile jobhunter08: every day of the work week and all day on saturday. i not only have a step daughter, i write for the gen y'ers. y'ers differ with work ethic and needs (among other things). most in my gen (x) were taught to work your way up the ladder and eventually one day you'll have the picket fence and a nice house. gen y'ers are taught that they are wonderful in whatever they endeavor to do and that they shouldn't work for the company, but start their own, and that possessions are just as important as friends. y'ers are generally more innovative when it comes to creating sources of money and take risks, while x'ers tend to stick the path and dip their toe in risky investments carefully. if you're looking to start a debate about this with me, don't bother. |
| Grateful Deadline | Posted – 5/20/2008 4:08:37 PM | show profile Apparently, job hunting is not the OP's issue. Let him go. |
| foodlit | Posted – 5/20/2008 4:21:17 PM | show profile JobHunter, The rent 450, refers to your share....one quarter of total rent. At this stage, you need roommates to cut expenses. |
| PluckyPane | Posted – 5/20/2008 4:33:30 PM | show profile you can get rent for a tiny 1 bedroom, but you'll have to live in cedar rapids, iowa to do it. and it comes with lovely yellow and orange appliances. |
| onmyown | Posted – 5/20/2008 4:33:58 PM | show profile mkelly, I always agree with you! ;) |
| consider | Posted – 5/20/2008 4:43:56 PM | show profile I am wondering if the *best* strategy is moving to Cow Town and reporting, too. I might not hire the OP (were I an editor) because I would prefer someone with solid reporting experience. I would not move at all, in fact, without a job prospect or two lined up. I'm wondering: Wouldn't the OP be better off moving to a smaller East Coast city that would allow him to be near NYC, but that would be large enough to offer jobs in a variety of different disciplines, like temp work, nonprofit, and the like? I would not move to kabmumfuck myself. I don't drive, is the biggest reason. But then again, I don't want to be a reporter (more of a page designer or online media type, myself), so I don't think I necessarily need to. I started a thread inquiring about the Baltimore-Philly job markets. I have no idea where the recession is worst, but in my Rust Belt 'hood, it basically just reared its ugly head. The rents are going up now, too. A ghetto apartment SHARE is 400 per month. |
| consider | Posted – 5/20/2008 4:50:50 PM | show profile To OP, if you're still reading and/or care. Lose the headhunters. They only recruit people with experience. This means they recruit for the senior managing editor of Dow Jones Newswires, stuff like that. Plus, it's always better if you address a cover letter to the person under whom you'll be working. Bypass HR. HR has no idea who is a good writer. Call the company and ask for names and e-mails. |
| jseconds77 | Posted – 5/20/2008 4:51:50 PM | show profile woah....jseconds not trying to start any guff here. I just relayed my (humble) experience. and ahem....sincere THANK YOUS to all journo vets who continue to post on this forum....helpful! entitlement? 'Me Generation" still bullies.... not from me...but swallowed pride with smaller pubs. and no leads in sight, and rumors swirling no $$ to even take on new staff confirmed by recession. no, no etitlement here. hope this calms any ill will? lemme know,,,, |
| jseconds77 | Posted – 5/20/2008 4:54:01 PM | show profile lastly, I never had any problem tracking down politicians, or even speaking with a woman who's friend went to prison for MURDERING her toddler. that's not even close to why I was fired....honestly, if a publisher can only draw ire from ONE article not done correctly, something is seriously rotten in Denmark. again, not trying to start a fight. and yes, thanks again to all journo vets. |
| seeattleme2 | Posted – 5/20/2008 5:53:10 PM | show profile Rent in Stockton california for a one bedroom apartment (they really don't have studios in such plaes, most of those are in flop houses for ex cons) runs $1200 a month. And Stockton has no daily that's hiring as ar as I know. |
